Even if somebody says, "There can't be śruti, can't hear." But I personally believe that there can be experiences of śruti. You can hear, the words can be heard and they need not be the words of scripture, need not be something which has to be, but of course, from that day one thing I learnt as a kind of a Scripture: when you want to do the Divine's work do not delegate it, you do it yourself! This is what I have derived afterwards in my life.
So that there can be a 'revelation' and revelation need not be something of the kind that we read in the Vedas or the Upanishads, but can be connected with ordinary things, like do ‘this’ or do ‘that’, and actually the Bhagavad Gita is of that kind: Sri Krishna tells Arjuna, “kill these people.” It is a revelation of a very special kind! Something that is so drastic and something so alarming, something so troubling but that such revelation can be, this I cannot doubt at all. It is a fact, it can happen.
The condition is that you should be in a state as 1 had experienced. It is a fact that my body was ‘on fire’, my whole body was burning. It is a fact that I said to the Divine in my heart that “I do not want to succeed. If that is the will of God that I must not succeed, please let me not succeed. But if it is the Divine's will that it should succeed, please see that it succeeds, and I will have no complaint either way.” And I could see that in that condition, there was this revelation: a way was opened up as it were and a further development took place. It was very important, actually to my mind that was a very important event in my life and in the life of the Divine's work in the world. Now this is a very small event, a negligible event in the history of the world, but it is an example that revelations can be of various kinds. Therefore, if I claim that now once revelation has come, all that I am thinking is a revelation is madness!
And many people in the world history, sometimes taken up by this kind of experience, which happens once quite rightly but it does not mean that every experience of his will be of the same value, because in every case, he will not be 'on fire' in every condition of his life. In every condition he may not have this state of equality that defeat or success makes no difference at all, and a prayer that only the Divine Will must manifest and nothing else: personal considerations are absolutely abolished. And that too, what is revealed at that time will not be revealed tomorrow, in the meantime the situation might have changed. So one must be ready to see that revelations can be of yesterday are true revelation, and next day the same revelation may be wrong; a new revelations may come and supersede the revelations of yesterday.
I think if the ordinance was to be lifted it could have been lifted in any way, it was perhaps to give you the experience it was sort of happening that way.
That could be, but the point is: may be that the judge would not have issued the ban at all, right from the beginning. That also could have been possible.
So it's perhaps for your pers...
May be. But I cannot interpret in any way. I simply say that I had this experience, that is all, and I was greatly benefited, greatly profited by this experience, and I was extremely happy the way in which it happened. But it is true that after it succeeded, I was not in a state of exultation: it was a state of equality still, whether I succeeded or I failed. It was a real fact that I was neither happy nor unhappy about it. It was given as it were, at the feet of God and it was God's action. I can simply say there was no role that I played. And as you could see in the story, I was not even required to speak to him on the phone, ultimately. I simply got this inspiration that I must speak myself and it was only communicated to him and this was the reply, in two minutes there was a complete change in the mind of the judge.
But you never enquired what happened to the judge?
How can I ask him? Because I never met him actually! I met him only at the court in his house since the Court was closed in the real court, he had taken vacation room in his own house. I simply met him there and my lawyer spoke to him simply and he gave the order simply, saying that the ban is lifted.
What were you saying?
Uncle, doesn’t the Truth get established when it is a personal experience, is it the definition of truth that we have to see it and establish in our very own being, otherwise it is just like as you said, so many books, so many literatures, so many opinions. Don't we establish that truth within us by experience?
Very true, very important. That is why one should never tell anybody, "Look, here is a truth. Accept it," This is what is called 'dogmatic teaching': 'Here is a revelation, it is given by a great spiritual seeker and a spiritual siddha, therefore now take it for granted to be true'. You should always verify your own experience and establish it in yourself, but there is intermediate position also. When somebody is seeking seriously, sincerely, he has still not established the truth in himself, but you can tell him, "in your search, I give you this which might help you, this is claimed to be a revelation, this is claimed to be a truth, and if you want to consider it, consider it, it may help". Even before you realise it in your own being, a revealed word can help. There is another way by which it can be helpful.