Dailogue with Teachers from Gandhi Vidhya Mandir, Sardarshehar
Children who are different, that is to say, I am not concerned with children who are good or better but children who are different. Children who do not want to be slaves of anybody except the Divine, therefore, the aim of education which they are pursuing or they would like to pursue or without knowing even because children do not know what they are but who are capable in due course to know that the most important thing to know in the world is the Divine and what is the Divine Will.
Similarly, everyone has to try to find out what is the Divine Will. So when I say children who are different are those children who, whether they know it or not, are here on this earth to discover what is the divine will, and I would like to serve these children and the teachers who want to serve these children.
When you speak in your ideal—Ahimsa, Satya, Asteya, Bramacharya, Aparigraha—all these aims, which you have laid down in your institution, are all preparatory for this work. If, by divine we mean the truth which is the real definition of truth-consciousness, even in the Veda it was called rita-chit.
To be a slave of McCaulay-ian system of education is what has brought about the ruin of India. How to combat the system?
When we speak of universalization of elementary education, the idea is that what is going on, now spread it, give the same thing.
There are many things which we need to discuss, many many things. Maybe in future we may have more opportunities of meeting together, but today I shall limit myself only to one issue: what is it that every child, every human being as a human being aught to learn as a human being? What should every human being as a human being should learn in life? You may become a doctor, engineer, lawyer, a coolie, a teacher whatever you might like to do, but, first of all our first question is: I am a human being and as a human being what should I learn.
I can share with you what I have ultimately arrived at the present, even though we have to continue on and on and on in answer to this question. I have come to the conclusion that every human being should learn four things. Since everybody lives life, he must discuss the question: what is the aim of life? Everybody, whether he becomes a doctor or lawyer whatever it may be his profession, but this is the first question and last question that you should ask: what is the aim of life?
At present because McCaulay struck off this idea from India, you are not allowed to ask this question at all. In no curriculum of India this question is centrally posed. Therefore, hardly anybody thinks about it. Children pick up some idea about what is life from some cinema dialogue and they take it as a guide for the whole life: jivan ek safar hai, jivan ek paheli hai. So many dialogues are there in the cinemas and we take it as if it is patheya.
So this is the first question that you should ask, and you should be able to answer this question or we should all be engaged in research.
Learning and teaching is an inherent profession of man, even as a parent you have to be a teacher, to learn and to teach is a constant phenomenon of human life. Therefore, it is only not only BA people who should learn what is teaching and learning, it is is artificial. It is the one subject which everyone in the country and the world should learn. What is learning? What is to be a good learner? What is it to be a good teacher? So this is the second question.
The third question is that every human being has got a body whether he likes it or not.
Just now I’m discussing a question as to what human being as a human being has to learn. So I said everybody should learn the aim of life because everybody lives. Second, is that everybody is a teacher and a pupil, so everybody should know what is it to be a good student and a good teacher. The third is that everybody has a human body. Therefore, he must know what is the human body, as a human being he should learn. And the fourth question that he has to ask is that everybody is required to, wherever he is, move upwards, wherever an individual finds himself or herself. His fundamental thrust is to move upwards, urdhva gama.
Therefore, this is the question. How do I move upward? What is it that will lift me? So I identified three important qualities which uplifts, which are the powers of upliftment, one at the power of illumination, the second is the power of heroism, and the third is the power of harmony. These are the three: illumination, heroism and harmony.
So, as I have told you, I am only sharing with you what I have been learning myself and making research in these fundamental problems, and I would like to share with you what I have so far arrived at. It is because of my concern with these problems that I have advocated what I call VValue-Oriented Education.
In fact, this term value oriented was coined by Dr Dave and myself when we were in the ministry of education together. At that time there were many discussions as to whether we should use this term value-oriented and, I said don't say value education but say value-oriented, because the moment you speak of value education there'll be debates.
What are the values required? My answer is, whatever you think are values, be oriented towards them, so no discussion as to what are the values, because endless debate is there in the world. My answer is: whatever you think is value and you can't escape values. Everybody has this trust towards values. You may differ as to what that value is, but there can be no debate that everyone should be turned towards values, so we decided upon this term value-oriented education.
Because of all this I have so far edited four books. I want to introduce these four books to you. The first book is called the Aim of Life. I have edited this book and in due course, I will show you this book. Also the second book is called the Good Teacher and the Good Pupil. The third book is Mystery and Excellence of the Human Body and the fourth book I am still writing, because I have planned to write 85 small booklets on the theme of illumination, heroism and harmony. 10 have been written, 75 remain to be developed as yet. So I would like to introduce, as far as I can, these four books during these two hours.
The method of these books is that of exploration. I do not want to tell people what should be the aim of life, that is to be left to the students themselves, but they should have data. The problem is that we preach something without giving the children the data, they explore by themselves alternatives. They should think about various alternatives, and we have no literature today in the country which can give you a rich literature.
What are the different aims of life? People have thought of life in many different ways. Our children should know different aims of life which have been pursued in the history of the world, right. Having made a study, they should decide: this is the aim of life. So it is in that context that I would like to show you the themes and some of the contents of this book.
In the course of the history of human endeavour, there have emerged four main theories of the aim of life in accordance with four different conceptions of the truth of existence. These may be called supracosmic, the cosmic and terrestrial, the supraterrestrial or otherworldly, and the integral or synthetic or composite. This is the conclusion I have arrived at after reading the history of the world. All the aims of life can be summed up in these four aims.
Now students may have to find out which of these four is a given aim of life which I'll be presenting one after the other.
Next. So, cosmic terrestrial belief, Supra terrestrial belief, the Integral belief. Next.
This is exploration has started.
This is another search by Buddha, what I call search for the utter transcendence.
What is Ishavasya Upanishad’s aim of life, I call it actually, if you examine it is integral aim of life. The whole Ishavasya Upanishad is a doctrine of synthesis. Everything is synthesized knowledge and ignorance, mrityu and amrityu, sambhava asambhava. This is complete synthesis tad ejati tad na ejati, It moves, It does not move.
I'm not taking your time because all this is I'm just showing you the book as if I'm opening the pages for you just to see because otherwise it will take 10 hours to expound the book.
This is Apology, heroic life. A life which is full of illumination and yet a heroic life.
This is one of the scenes from Socratic life that while he's being hemlock.
Are you not ashamed that you give your attention to acquiring as much money as possible and similarly with reputation and honor and give no attention or thought to truth and understanding and the perfection of your soul? This was the question that he has put.
Now just opposite to it is the aim of life that was pursued by Alexander. Adventure and ambition he put forth before the mankind, ‒ you should be adventurous, you should be ambitious, right or wrong, but the students should know this also is an aim of life which has been pursued by some people and many people. Even today many people believe that this is the aim of life, ‒ be ambitious. So let them understand the life of Alexander. Learn from him what he achieved as a result of ambition.
Next. Now you come to another aspect of life ‒ Jesus Christ, the Sermon on the Mount. There is no ambition, be meek, be humble, be like a child. Love thy neighbor as thyself. It's a message of love, compassion, sacrifice.
This is from Nitishatakam of Bhartrihari. It is neither God, nor man, nor life ‒ Niti, the hundred verses that he wrote on Nitishatakam. I would like students to study that. So this book gives some examples of Nitishatakam so that students learn.
Now, Prophet Muhammad, he spoke of the submission to the Will of the Supreme. It’s a tremendous message that he has given. It is exactly the same which the Gita says, submission to the Will of the Supreme.
Now here Shankaracharya comes and says life is a dream. So question of relentless ambition, adventure doesn't arise. The life is a dream, the Brahman is real, the world is a lie. Brahma satyam jagat mithya.
This is a famous letter that he wrote to his king when he was a young man and he was looking for a job. He wrote this letter. It's a very famous letter which I would like students to learn at that time what he knew. And he says he was not only a painter, he was a sculptor, he was an architect, he was a great engineer, he was an atomist. His perfection was all rounded perfection.
These are some of his sketches, even of bridges and so on.
Here is the message of Sri Chaitanya Ecstasy of Divine Love. It's love of Christ, but also more than that, it's a different quality of love. And people should know what are different messages of love in the world. This is another example, what kind of love for the divine.
Here is a thinker he devoted his life in search of existence of God, but critically to examine the question of God, whether God exists or not, can you prove intellectually? And he's very famous for his proof for the existence of God and the human soul. His famous book is Meditations in French. And it's a very famous book because ontological argument for the existence of God. A famous argument. I would like students to learn that argument. You may agree with it, you may not agree with it. But as somebody who has explored this question and many people even today believe that he has finally given the argument, his argument is irrefutable. I am one of those who believe that he has given irrefutable argument for the existence of God. So many people who today say unless you prove to me intellectually I don't believe in God, I would ask him to read this particular proof. It's a very difficult proof, but he has given the proof. And children, students should know that there is in the world somebody who has given the proof, intellectual proof of the existence of God.
This is Einstein. He has also a view of the world. He doesn't deal with God, no spirit but acutest perception of the world. And that acutest perception has led him to visualize the fourth dimension. And this is very important. Space and time, he said, are both joined together. Space and time is not a correct idea. Space-time is a correct idea and the time is the fourth dimension of space itself. He has proved it. And therefore it is very important that students should learn. That is to say, our students should be led to very high level of thinking before they decide what is the aim of life?
Now, not many people know that Nehru wrote a very important chapter in one of his books called Life's Philosophy. And modern man is likely to gel with his view where he says there is too much to do in life; life is too short to do all that is to be done. So he says there may be God, there may not be God. I'm not very much concerned. Here is so much to do in the world, so let me do here. That was his view. I don't agree with it. But anyway, that is his view. And children should know that there is a powerful leader of India who wanted to do for the world.
Read this. Essentially, I am interested in this world.
Next. I have been affected by this and so in a sense I am favorably disposed towards these assumptions. There might be a soul which survives the physical death of the body and a theory of cause and effect governing life's actions seems reasonable, though it leads to obvious difficulties when one thinks of the ultimate cause. Presuming a soul there appears to be some logic also in theory of reincarnation.
Well, this sums up the theory of Jawaharlal Nehru, which most of the modern men today adopt. It's very important that people should know what exactly there should no vagueness in the ideas of the children. From class one to class 1 to class12, twelve years the children are given to us. Within twelve years these things are not very big things, no burden at all. They can very well be given to our children if teachers know about it. That's why these books are written only for teachers.
I now come to the next book The Good Teacher and the Good Pupil. Here also the method is of exploration.
Next, once again, explorations.
Now, Buddha, not many people know what Buddha was as a pupil. People know Buddha as a teacher. So I have corrected material in this book. How he used to study himself, how he went from teacher to teacher to learn. We all know that he left his great kingdom on that midnight. But after that he went from teacher to teacher until he arrived at a conclusion that all the teachers that they had to teach, they had all exhausted. And then he turned to himself and he found the real teacher within himself and attained to Nirvana. Now, this whole story is therefore very important for teachers to know.
Now, here I come again to Socrates and to Plato, where there is a theory of learning that Learning is Recollection. It is to be recognized that both Socrates and Plato believed in theory of rebirth, as Indians believe. And according to Socrates and Plato, all that we need to learn is actually known to the soul, only it has been forgotten. And a good teacher is one who removes the forgetfulness and brings back the knowledge. And not many people know that Plato wrote one great dialogue called Meno. The title of the dialogue is called Meno. The incident that is described in this dialogue is that Socrates goes to a teacher who believes that teaching is to be done from outside. Socrates says that it is not correct. You should only remove the difficulties of the student his knowledge will emerge from himself. So he laughs at him and says, how can it be so? He said, call your slave. Meno is a slave. So he's called.
Now, here are some examples given from what is called philosophy of Zen. This is taken from Buddhism. Zen actually means dhyana. And when it went into Japan and other countries of Southeast Asia and East, the Buddhistic way of teaching and learning was refined. And one of the methods is what is called method of New Awareness.
Sufis also have developed similar methods, but what they call wisdom. See, we always talk of information, knowledge and wisdom. Three levels of journey in the field of knowledge, information. Knowledge and wisdom. What is wisdom? Wisdom is neither information nor even knowledge. So wisdom certainly must have all the information. It must also have knowledge in the sense interconnections of information is knowledge. So you must also be a knower. But wisdom has a greater insight. That is to say, wisdom enters into information and knowledge as if he enters into the cave and from the cave, brings out something which is neither known in information nor in knowledge. That is called wisdom. A wise man he is the one who is able to delve deep and bring out something which is neither captured in information nor in knowledge. A simple example is a famous story of camels.
It's a great Story of Initiation, where Yusuf it's also a Sufi story told by the Mother to students in the Ashram at Pondicherry. He wanted to learn from his teacher. He wanted to be initiated like a brahmacharin of the ancient times. The teacher is not sure whether is capable of learning or not. So for three, four years does not answer him at all but he remains.
Here is another from the West — The Would-be Gentleman. It is a story of what not should be done, not what ought to be done but what not be done. It is an example of a gentleman, a very rich man. He wants to be called a gentleman. That is his aim. It is a French drama written by Molère who was one of the greatest humorists of French literature. In French it is called Le Bourgeois Gentilhomme — The Would-be Gentleman — who wants to be gentleman so he appoints seven teachers — an athlete, logician, a poet and many other things, even fencing. So many teachers he keeps so that he becomes a very learned man. It is a flop. If you simply want to be a gentleman and want to study for the purpose to be called a gentleman, you can never learn. Ultimately, learns nothing although in the course he discovers that there is only one thing which he knew very well what is called prose. When the teacher tells him do you know the distinction between prose and poetry? He says no, I neither know prose nor poetry. The teacher says you know what you are speaking is called prose so that is the one revelation he got and he learned what is called prose. It is a very interesting and hilarious story to be told all the children and all the teachers of the world. If you really want to study, you should be really seeking knowledge, true knowledge, merely by keeping seven teachers you cannot learn.
This is a good example of a student who used to abscond from his he said that one should not abscond from the school. But here is an example of a good student who did it. Wordsworth, the great poet. He was so fond of nature. He used to run away from the school just to be in love with nature. And as you know, he became a very great poet of nature. The point is here that our school system obliges the children to abscond. If visiting nature was a part of school system, he would not have absconded. Our school system is wrong. We do not allow the child to move about as Tagore would have been very happy to have this kind of pupil in his Shantiniketan.
This is one of the greatest philosophers of education, Rousseau. He wrote a great book called Emile.
This is a great story written by Tagore called Parrot's Training. I would like every student of B. Ed. to study this particular story.
Here is a great example of Sullivan and Helen Keller.
This is famous Montessori. We all know about Montessori methods of education. You have heard about her, but you must read something about her. Therefore in this chapter I have brought some of the original writings of Montessori so that at least one or two good lessons of hers are known. And she bombarded many theories of education which is current at that time. And she said that child one of the great discoveries of the child is child likes to repeat. This is one of the very important messages she has given. And child likes to repeat, the more she learns, the more she likes to repeat. When a child knows a story which you are going to tell she herself wants to tell the story and even ten times she wants to tell the same story because she knows the story.
Now once again I bring Nehru because not many people know that Nehru was also a great teacher. And if you read the letters that Nehru wrote to India Gandhi they are excellent examples of being a good teacher, a father being a good teacher through correspondence even the value of correspondence is underlined through these letters. You may not know the value of writing. One good letter is more important than giving ten lectures to a child. A letter written by a teacher or by anybody.
One of the methods of good teaching is teachers writing letters to the children, happy service to the children. I myself made experiments in my own school where I was teaching 40 students philosophy at the same time and every morning I spent 2 hours in writing letters to my students. It is a very successful message what you cannot teach by lectures, you can teach by letter because every child wants to read what you write. It is personal to him and it will be read again and again. It will read again and again. It's a tremendous stipulation.
This is Bertrand Russell again not as a philosopher but as an educationist. Tremendous. He made himself experiments in education. He was a great advocate of freedom in education. No rote learning, but allowing children to ask questions and to give from side of the teacher, great objectivity and impartiality. These are the great qualities he valued very much. Children should not be indoctrinated, but we should give them lessons impartially.
This is another one The Little Prince by Saint Exupery. He was a great pilot, he used to travel by air. It's a true story. And he went from place to place by plane. And one day his plane got lost and he entered into a kind of a desert. And there he wrote a diary. It's a diary about his discovery. There was a small little prince.
This is also another great story. Jonathan Livingston Seagull by Richard Bach.
This is the last one To Parents, Teachers and Pupils by the Mother. The greatness of this book is it the smallest book. But I regard to be the greatest book on education. The very first chapter is called Science of Living. It is not art of living. It's not philosophy of living. It is science of living. It's a claim in this book even in our present time Mahapragya ji has started the idea of Jeevan Vijayan, science of living. Science of living can be created only by those who have lived totality of life. Till the time you can only philosophize about life. But when you have seen the full gamut of life and seen all aspects of life then only you can see the science of living. And she has written a book on this subject what is Science of Living?
These are some of these topics I give to teachers to debate.
A good student is judged by his enthusiasm and by the intensity of his quest.
A good student needs no teachers.
A good teacher produces good students. A good student is a born good student.
You have to discuss these questions by the way, if you have a meeting, you should have good subject for discussion.
Students should learn in order to earn. This is one of the aims of education.
Students should learn in order to learn. And to learn how to learn is to learn how to live.
These are again other questions to be debated by teachers.
This is the last day of his retirement. And this is the theme, the thing that the student who he taught so well has now become the Governor of the State and she has now come and says this is for you.
I think I've taken lot of your time already.You have still many more things to show. But it doesn't matter today. We can stop here if you like.
I think we can continue for some more time.
You would like to continue then we can go to the next one.
If you can highlight a bit methodology and guidelines for the plan application.
The third one is Tagore’s Philosophy of Education. And there you don't have any dearth of literature. Tagore himself has written a lot on education. And I would like very much Tagore’s Theory of Philosophy of Education to be talked to our teachers. His book called My School is a great book by itself. His book Sadhana is another book and many other books, even Lipika small book which has so many short stories are extremely good stories for education of teachers.
The fourth book that I would recommend is Vivekananda’s Man Making Education on which Swami Ragnathan has written.
And the fifth book that I recommend is what I showed here, On Education by the Mother. And Sri Aurobindo’s book called A National System of Education, which he wrote in 1909, nearly 100 years ago. But it gives Indian Theory of Education in its proper perspective. A National System of Education that is one another he wrote National Value of Art. Another book that he wrote which also should be read. Third one he wrote is Brain of India, a very short book but extremely powerful. Brain of India.
This entire system of philosophy of education. I would very much like that your B.Ed course should include these five great philosophers of India to be represented. Our children should know what our great Indians have taught. Otherwise our children think that only Westerners are thinking about education, India has nothing to offer.
If you want to read another book which is extremely important for Indian education is Taittiriya Upanishad is the Indian Classical book on education.There is one full chapter called Shikshawalli in Upanishad. The very first chapter is called Shikshawalli. It's a manual of education. I would very much like that our students know at least Taittiriya Upanishad as a standard work on education of ancient India. The method of teaching is given. Even the syllabus is given. Even the convocation address even now we are using is from this Upanishad. All universities today have convocation addresses at the end dharmam chara satyam vada that advice which is being given is the last part of Shikshawalli of the Taittiriya Upanishad. So this is what I would like to recommend.
So let me now come to this if you want to see this. This is the book which I would like. What is The Mystery and Excellence of the Human Body? First of all our teachers should know what a wonderful instrument the human body is and how mysterious it is. Even today what we know about the human body is perhaps only 100th of what should be known. We do not know much about human body and I am showing here first of all a small article from Alexis Carrel.
I'm running very fast because we don't have much time but you will see just the titles.
It's a story of a man who revived himself only by eating only grapes and nothing else. So how one can have right nutrition and one can cure one's own body.
Then there is a part III called ‘Healing’. Every teacher should know that body can be healed and what are the items which you should know. Insights from Indian wisdom then will to live and healing. Healing by visualization and concentration. A severe case of hypochondria. Some people have the habit of saying I am always ill. It produces illness rather than health. So one should come out of that disease.
We also have interview with Narotam Puri. He's one of the television personalities and a great commentator on physical education. Then we also written something on P. T. Usha, then Zetopec also, and then Bodybuilding an Introduction. This, if you like I would like to show you from Arnold, who is now one of the governors of USA, one of the state. He was a great bodybuilder. Kindly take a look at him. This is what he says: ‘I want to be the best built man in the world’, when he was a young boy, this is what he decided. At 14, he started an intensive training program. At 15, he studied psychology to learn more about the power of mind over body. At 17, he officially started his competitive career.
Next. Arnold knew that you had to have more than just a massive frame and totally tweaked muscles to win. You also had to have the strongest will. At just 20 years old, he was the youngest Mr. Universe in the history. Arnold had accomplished part of his dream. Next. If he really wanted to accomplish his dream of being the best built man, he would have to win them all. Mr. Universe, Mr. World, Mr. Olympia. And he won all, determination, willpower, discipline, self control.
He won an unprecedented seven Mr. Olympia titles before he retired. This is the advice he has given which is worth studying. Fitness must start at an early age; get daily physical education back into schools. These classes not only get young people fit and reduce their cholesterol, their stress and their health risk, at the same time also increase the stamina, their energy and their coordination. In addition, they also learn valuable tools for life, discipline, camaraderie, competition and they gain self esteem and do better academically. But most importantly, young people learn how to stay healthy. And because they feel good about themselves, they are less likely to be to get involved with drugs or alcohol.
First, we should put apples and oranges in our vending machines and take out the junk food. Second, insist we test student’s fitness levels. We test in math, English, science. Why not test in the area of physical fitness too? It is just as important to grow up fit as it is to grow up smart.
In this book, I have found aspects of physical education. It's a great message of Sri Aurobindo on physical education, which I would like every teacher and students to read.
Part VI deals with courage and handicapped Triumphant Courage.
He moved to create a grand alliance against the Axis powers through the Declaration of the United Nations January 1, 1942. With all nations fighting the Axis, they agreed not to make a separate peace and pledge themselves to a peacemaking organization now the United Nations, on victory. Many years after his death, Eleanor Roosevelt once remarked that his illness was a blessing in disguise. It gained strength and meant that he understood human suffering and knew that it could be overcome. He also knew that one must have spiritual and physical courage. And if one had that, there was no situation.
There are many stories here told of Tenzing, Reinold Messner and Steven Callahan. Next we go faster.
In the integral yoga the body is looked upon as an instrument of the spirit. Here the human body is required to achieve not only high degrees of excellence, but also self perfections, which can be expected when the spirit manifests fully in the physical body. Last is the Perfection of the Body a great article written by Sri Aurobindo, which I think every teacher of physical education should learn and every teacher in fact should learn.
We can show this example what is mutation? Caterpillar becomes a butterfly by process of mutation. It's a small story. Children going to see what a caterpillar is and how it becomes ultimately a butterfly. It goes now in hibernation for months. Sri Aurobindo's was spoken of the divine body. How the new body will come about? There are three steps for the mutation of the human body.
I think we stop here now, because there is series of ten books.
I tell you, they have a great power. Academic councils of every university can be influenced by the Vice Chancellors, if they want to get a message. All universities are autonomous. All universities, even one university can do it and can show boldness that in my university teacher education will be of this kind. Without boldness, without bravery, without courage, without heroism in this world, no action can be done. Someone has to break the ice.
Therefore, in spite of those limitations, what he says can be done. Second, is it's not all? My first answer since he's here, I'm telling. second is that Education Ministers of the country should be addressed by its Vice Chancellors. Many Education Ministers they are ignorant of education. Most of them, many I would say. They do not know even the wheels of education machinery in our country. What is NCRT? What is NCTE? Even the major bodies of education they are ignorant about. Therefore, they are not capable of doing anything excepting running the schools and transfers favoritism nepotism. That's their power. And they feel very proud that they can do it. And they're engaged. I have a very humorous example.
The Governor of UP at one time was a great friend of mine. And he called his Education Minister and he told her to meet me, discuss with me what can be done in education in UP. I was very hopeful. We had very good discussion with her. She was very respectful. She came to meet me. So I said, well, you have a great chance today. UP is a very large state. If you do in UP something, the whole country will follow ultimately. Her only question was only one. Her only question was I don't have school buildings. That's the only problem that was nagging her. As if educational situation, teachers, what is the fundamentals of education? Nothing, Bhavan kaha hai. I had to give an answer as to how to get buildings. Even how to get money for buildings for the schools from the Finance Ministry even that is an art. Even that many Education Ministers don't know. They are told here is a budget already given. When you become Education Minister, you are told by your secretaries ‒ madam, sir, this is the budget. And within that budget you have to do everything, as if it is a scripture given to you God's word you cannot break it. They are not even told that you can break this budget, if you want it and how you can break the budget. No Finance Minister will agree to break your budget unless you have good scheme. You should prepare a good scheme. Go to the Finance Minister and no good Finance Minister will refuse you. Budgets are breakable, and many ministers don't know that budgets can be broken. If you want money for buildings, you can go to Finance Ministry if you have good scheme. If you can give all the right figures that here are the children so many uneducated, we have program, we have promised to the world, we shall have universalization of elementary education, we need so many buildings but your mathematics should be correct, should be convincing; at least that much work you should do. In other words, even with preliminary things, our Education Ministers are not equipped.
Comment: And people like you who have all the answers.
Conversations in Hindi.
A donkey finds out how to eat, how to reproduce, you don't need to train a donkey how to eat and how to find out the food for itself. Education is really meant only for that which you cannot normally do yourself.